I really like this idea. The Knight of the Round Table could be involved in capturing Demonreach's prisoners and I wouldn't be surprised if the island was Avalon, only the legends got it a little wrong.

Also, if Arthur returns I think it would be really amusing to see him quickly adapt to a new world to the point where he is more comfortable with modern technology than Dresden.

 

I don't remember that and I would have a hard time believing that's true. Maybe they cant flat out stop it but bare minimum I'd think that they have a way of hiding them from the Denarians similar to what was done to Micheal's panic room, if you don't already know where to look you cant find it. If they have literally no protection against that whatsoever then what would be the point in the Denarians raids on the vaults or corrupting church officials to take them. Why would the Church even bother trying to contain them at all? How hard would it be for Nick to make a handful of his cultists touch the coins, make a connection and then instantly summon them back anytime they lose one to the Church if they really are utterly unprotected?

 

Wonder how the other knights would fit in then, though. Even if we assume all three swords were in the possession of the Knights of the Round Table, with Lancelot being the other one who surely had one if that was the case, what were the others? How could they keep up with the dark gods of chaos and the eldritch abominations if they did not have holy swords of God?

I kind of doubt that there are more special swords out there that do similar things. It could be possible, which would mean that Harry was wrong and Amoracchius is not Excalibur, but somehow, would lessen the meaning of the swords. Could also be that Arthur and his knights were not humans but supernatural creatures. Or it was just Arthur and Merlin and the legends let it snowball, adding all the other knights or whatnot.

Anyway, all useless speculation anyway xD But seeing that he gave Merlin such an important role, have the feeling that Merlin will be significant too. I mean, his sword appeared, his mentor appeared, doubt he will be left out.

Doubt Butcher would want to miss out on Monty Python and Camelot the Musical jokes.

Edit: The Dresden Files wiki quotes Butcher like this, dunno if actually true:

So, if there is not going to be another wielder until the apocalypse, would make sense that it remains unused until its rightful owner comes along, who would only appear at the end when the need for him is the greatest.

 

But you don't need the Swords to fight evil. I think Merlin and Arthur were handling the big guys and the knights were there as support and to deal with the minions, like Dresden's friends ofter do.

"Arthur, you are hurt," said Molly.

"This," said the Once and Future King. "'Tis but a scratch!"

Everyone groaned.

 

You misunderstand something.. only the owner of the coin can summon it back. It is not like every Host/Denerian can summon every coin it is more like only the shadow can summon the real one. And I don´t think that something like multiple ownership is possible.. at least there is nothing in the books that would support such a theory.

 

Then why did Harry who never took up the coin and only touched it the one time get informed by Lash that she could show him how to call it directly to him? That's an extraordinarily wide definition of ownership if that's the case.

 

True, but it seemed to me, the one of the worst things that Harry fought was in the low security part of the prison, alongside 6 or so beings who were just as strong as it was. And deeper in the prison were things that made those creatures look like minions. Harry's friends are often outmatched by "lesser" beings, and only stand a chance when time and place is in their favor, alongside luck. Seeing that the prison is full with big bads, I doubt that it was the case with every single one of them. Seems to me, Merlin and Arthur went and imprisoned them regularly, without that much fuss.

Normal knights wouldn't really stack up to that and be all that useful. Although, would be funny if Merlin, Arthur and the Knights were just as much of a ragtag group as Harry and friends. (Then again, Merlin seems to be in an entirely different weight-class than Harry and Arthur was supposedly too, so, I guess it works out. Michael was able to kill a Dragon on his own when the sword truly kicked in, if Arthur had that effect every time he fought, I can see them tackling gods)

That brings another question. Seeing that the prison is on multiple time levels (kind off) do you guys think that prisoners are still being added to it? As in, Merlin, in a different timeline, still imprisons dark gods? Or was that an effort from before he "died" or whatever happened to him? Harry is the Warden and all but it seems Merlin is still building it in another dimension/timeline...

Coconut horse? :awesome

 

Maybe because it was Lasciel who owned Harry at the time?

 

Ehhh its possible but that seems off that the Fallen could "own" anyone without their very explicit permission before hand. As I recall Michael said something to the effect of only people with drug problems or who are already susceptible to that sort of thing can be affected by the Fallen without the persons permission.

 

Two things. One, I think it was stated that Harry did take up the coin of his own free will, even if he didn't want to admit it. And two, she even branded him.

 

No, I think taking it up and picking it up are two very different things. Taking it up is becoming a full fledged Denarian, he just slapped his hand on it and then very shortly thereafter buried in a deep dark hole and never touched it again. As for the brand that could easily be explained as what happens when you make skin contact with the coin, the angels mark appears on you somewhere.

 

I can't find the quote, but I remember that someone told Dresden that he didn't just picked up the coin, even if he believed it himself. He could easily prevent Harry Carpenter from getting it without touching it himself, but on some level he decided otherwise.

Or maybe I'm confusing it with some fan speculations.

 

Im not saying I couldn't be confusing some things but as I recall that was explained as more of a subconcious impulse that he did with no real thought and to take up a coin/become a Denarian you have to flat out say "Yes please ancient evil I want you to play in my brain" which Harry very firmly and repeatedly refused.

 

Not sure what you problems are. It is unimportant if he did touch the coin voluntarily or not. He did touch it, Lasciel accepted so he can summon it if wants/accepts it. Because like I said.. nothing in the book supports multiple ownership of the coins. 1 coin, 1 shadow. You kill the owner-> nobody can summon it.

 

Returning to what we were talking about in the first place, I think that the Fallen can "own" only one person at the time. Sure, we don't have any proof for that, but otherwise I see no reason why Denarians wouldn't have a small army of their Shadows running around.

 

And it could easily be that your right but until we get more info on the specifics I just have a really hard time buying that the Church or Heaven even is completely unable to protect the coins.

Erandil: I didnt say a thing about multiple ownerships, what I said was why would the Fallen be incapable of making more than one shard of themselves to split off? None of them have to own it or get a damn bit of power from it, just split off a tiny little piece so the person can summon it.

 

My read of it has always been that only a person with a Shadow in their mind can summon a coin. I think we're all agreed on this.

There is no WoJ on whether two people can have a Shadow of the same Fallen.

However, it's entirely possible that the Fallen themselves have no idea, since according to Lash, Harry had held out on 'taking up' the coin longer than anyone, ever. It's likely the coins had always been taken up by the one person who had a Shadow before it could make contact with another in the past.

I want to see what happens when Lasciel's coin gets impatient...

Of course, I also want to see what happens when ten people who all want a coin get a hand on it at once, or it goes bouncing from hand to hand like in a farce before anyone can take it up. Could ten different people call the coin at the same time? Would the coin (or the Fallen therein) then choose? Or would it be held between them all?

 

If they could just summon their coins whenever they feel like it, why didn't the snake-Denarian just get his back like that? Instead he had to go after Harry's Coin in Dead Beat.

 

I assumed it was because Dresden had the Shadow in his head but hadn't accept becoming a Denarian. If he had then that time(and only that time) the coin would come to him.

 

Another very good point, Cassius was very damned old and so I have a hard time believing that he wouldn't have just summoned his coin back from the Church the first chance he got if that was possible. If I had to take a stab at it personally those holy hankies/boxes are a small scale portable way of preventing the Fallen from expending their influence around them and preventing summoning of the coins.