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DOTA 2

Discussion in 'Gaming and PC Discussion' started by leenK, Dec 9, 2011.

  1. Innomine

    Innomine Alchemist ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    So, I'm very new to the Dota 2 scene, what are some upcoming events to watch? Also, I know there hasn't been much East vs West in tournaments apart from The Internationals in the past, can we expect that to change now?
     
  2. Al'Akir

    Al'Akir Third Year

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    @Innomine

    Starladder Starseries (Top EU teams except mouz)
    EMS (EU and NA teams)
    I think NSL (korean league) might have top EU and Asian teams in the future but don't see them doing it right now.
     
  3. Wildfeather

    Wildfeather The Nidokaiser ~ Prestige ~

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    I don't know if spectating would really help with DOTA like it does with League. Maybe for builds, I guess, but a lot of the game (like 80% easily) is mechanical skills and zone control.
     
  4. DemonicInfluence

    DemonicInfluence Fourth Year

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    Not really, I think the majority of the game is awareness. Awareness of what the enemies can do and what they can't. Awareness of what picks are good and what heroes just suck ass. Watching games can really help with that.
     
  5. Iztiak

    Iztiak Prisoner DLP Supporter

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    I don't believe that's accurate.

    First, there's what Demonic said, there's a great deal you can learn just by watching, especially knowing what various characters do. You can do that by playing all the different characters, but it's easy to pick up while watching a game and listening to the casters analyze why they're doing what they're doing. This doesn't just go for dota, this goes for all games where a big part of your success is knowledge about the game.

    But really, there's all sorts of stuff that you can pick up by watching. Watching the pros rotate their team and/or supports is extremely helpful to learn how to keep the momentum of the game on your side. You see how the supports keep the carry alive and also manage to stack and ward and gank other lanes. You can also learn when not to do that. From what I've heard, a big part of Alliance's success is because of the obsessive jungle stacking that their supports do.

    There's all sorts of little stuff you can find out too. Hell, back when I started, I never thought about breaking the trees behind the pull camp on radiant side and pulling your lane creeps even farther into the jungle. Not until I saw them doing it in a tournament anyway.

    Watching what pro Furion/sylla/visage players do with their minions has been extremely helpful for me too, their micro is very effective.

    Sure, you can learn a lot of this stuff just by playing, eventually. So if you hate spectating tournaments, by all means don't. Other people watch them, and you'll notice lots of people trying to copy what they were doing and be able to pick it up yourself. I wouldn't expect this starting out though.

    TL;DR Not really.
     
  6. Innomine

    Innomine Alchemist ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Yeah, I agree with what everyone else said. Honestly, my skill level jumped miles after watching The International 3. I also spent some time watching Dendi and Sing_Sing stream. Sing was especially useful, as he commentates his games, which explains his train of thought.

    I learnt SC2 through watching it as well.
     
  7. Wildfeather

    Wildfeather The Nidokaiser ~ Prestige ~

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    I would say that map awareness and character knowledge are a mechanic of the game (where mechanic is a object that relates to the way you interact with the game or some factor in the game that modifies its play).
     
  8. theronin

    theronin Order Member

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    Honestly, regardless of whether or not you are learning anything, watching pro level dota is FUN. I don't think I've even played a game since then though, need to get back into it one of these days.
     
  9. Innomine

    Innomine Alchemist ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Yeah, but your argument was that we don't learn anything from it, which I completely disagree with.

    Not to mention, as theronin said, it's besides the point. I watch Dota 2 for enjoyment. Not to learn. It's just a good byproduct. :p
     
  10. SmileOfTheKill

    SmileOfTheKill Magical Amber

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    I use professional Dota games as a standard to judge my understand of the game. If I can't accurately explain why everything is done, I have failed.
     
  11. Innomine

    Innomine Alchemist ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    How do you know if you're accurate or not though? :p
     
  12. The Arid Legion

    The Arid Legion Professor

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    If you don't know whether or not you're accurate then you have also failed.
     
  13. Innomine

    Innomine Alchemist ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Seems pretty flimsy to me. :p
     
  14. SmileOfTheKill

    SmileOfTheKill Magical Amber

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    The best way to figure out if I am correct is what I predict being correct. I've called out every best new hero on the scene being picked in mass but Visage, and I can tell exactly what a hero does for a given composition. I do always fear that I am just changing what I think to match what happens, but I have balance experience. Real balance experience. Been apart of a few HoN patches back in the day and I've talked to some of the people that were involved in making Skeleton Kings stun different from Sven, so real old timers.
     
  15. theronin

    theronin Order Member

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    Things in China have finally settled down, but now we get this: http://p.t.qq.com/longweibo/index.php?id=347837065549259

    Kaipi get's sponsored by Rattlesnake and will play under the Rattlesnake.int tag. They are moving to China in December. Should be interested to see how htis turns out. I think that KP is currently being held back by EternalEnvy. His game sense tends to be pretty sketchy and it's cost them in the past. Moving to China with their emphasis on safe play should do him a lot of good.

    On a related note, I wonder how Valve is going to do the invites for TI4. LGD.int was an anomaly for TI3, so they could get an invite without screwing with the region balance too much, but if international teams become more common they may have to change that up.
     
  16. Wildfeather

    Wildfeather The Nidokaiser ~ Prestige ~

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    Maybe this is a noobish question, but why is Zeus/TB seen in so little constructed play? He seems like a solid burst caster and consistent dps from mid lane and double ult can be very strong clean up or disengage for teams. Is it merely a meta issue (low mobility and casters don't scale well) or are there concrete reasoms why Zeus/TB doesnt see play?
     
  17. theronin

    theronin Order Member

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    1. Magic Wand
    2. No stuns
    3. Horrible attack animation

    Mid lane is dominated by initiators (e.g. Puck, Bat, Storm) and hard farming semi-carries who can completely take over the midgame (e.g. DK, SF, OD). If all you want is burst damage, you are better of taking a QoP or even a Nyx Assassin mid.

    Arteezy actually experimented with Zeus mid for a while, I think specifically as a counter to shadow fiend, but I don't think it ever gained much traction.
     
  18. Al'Akir

    Al'Akir Third Year

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    Zeus in a hero without escape. In mid lane it's crucial to have some blink/stun/invis/etc. Or to be fat like Pudge, DK, BM.

    Even Invoker with his low base damage is a lot stronger mid hero than Zeus.
     
  19. theronin

    theronin Order Member

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    The escape is not strictly speaking necessary. Plenty of solid mid heroes get away with not having one, but you have to play a lot more carefully. The best example is shadow fiend. Super squishy, no escape, but still gets away with going mid since he has the tools to win the lane and completely take over the midgame is a way that Zeus can only dream of doing.
     
  20. Skykes

    Skykes Minister of Magic DLP Supporter

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    Zeus is a good mid in pub games, but against an organised team he will not be let steamroll.

    I like to put 1 in chain lightning, max bolt and 1 in e, taking ulti at 6, 11 and 16. Use chain to last hit until you get bottle, if you don't miss any it should be enough. Use runes to gank side lanes/harass mid off lane.

    If their mid hero contests for runes then just push the wave at the right time so he has to either sacrifice experience, or give up the rune. The is the only way you can get runes as Zeus has a very low base move speed and only a mini stun.

    Pro tip: If a enemy is invisible your ulti will only reveal him, not damage, unless he is already revealed, in which case he takes the hit.
     
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