Naturally talented singers rarely have something so arbitrary as blood determining their talent though.

This is actually one plot bunny of yours that I don't like, Xandrel. Maybe it's just because recently I keep encountering fics with bleak shitholes as their setting and I have no desire to keep reading on more of that, at the moment, at least.

 

I've been burnt out on 'bleak shitholes' too lately. I like surprises and if everything reads like Sin City or Sailor Moon; I get bored. I would like to see a well-balanced fic where it can be dark, goofy, fluffy, and fun to read at times. You know, like the original HP set.

 

I get what you're saying, but we're not talking about a high skill level needed in this instance. If it were something along the lines of more... ritualistic magic, where dancing or drawing circles, or even making their own focus... something that actually requires a degree of artistic talent then I'd agree, there would be a various levels, but we're talking about flicking a wand and saying a word. That doesn't require innate talent, just memorization and a little practice to perform a spell properly.

 

There's something about the Blood Purity thing actually mattering that really bothers me. It could be the relatively arbitrariness of it, since where does one go from Muggleborn to Halfblood to Pureblood? It could be the possibility someone could not only attempt a "Master Race" breeding thing, but actually succeeding. It could be the fact you still have Voldemort as the Big Bad despite his new obvious inferiority.

I'm not saying I like this idea, but I do think there are two routes someone could take with this:

1. Have the Big Bad be a group attempting to breed a Master Race with absolutely Pure Blood for ages, culminating in a sort-of Super-Wizard.

2. Have the Big Bad be the non-Purebloods who hate their inferior status in life, and work to undermine the current system however they can.

 

And suddenly I want to read Sailor Moon/Sin City crossover

Or maybe just Harry Potter/Sailor Moon crossover, done right.

 

I've only read crack!fics like that. What would a crossover like that "done right" look like?

 

Look at ff.net section for this crossover, and see how this isn't done. Bascially, raping either magical system, making it inferior to the other one, throwing ""true love" and "soul bonds" into every character interaction, and making half of HP cast, reincarnations from Silver Millenium. That's fucking lazy and boring.

Hell, I had an idea for a DLP Fight CLub challenge with Sailor Moon. Auror Harry Potter is sent to Japan to track a runaway female Unspeakable, that performed experiments on time and transformation magic. She stole some experimental transfiguartion tools, burned half the deppartament to the ground, and vanished. After some long and hard investigation, it was discovered that she fled to Japan, and has been sighted in Tokyo. More precisly in Juban. It appears that she goes by the name Setsuna Meiou. You can take it from here, if you want.

 

Nearly the entire idea behind the books, the lesson (if any) one is supposed to take away from reading them, is that the pure-bloods aren't any better than the half-bloods aren't any better than the muggle-borns; all that prejudice regarding blood status is wrong.

And, yeah, I get that the whole idea of fan fic is to do something other than what was in the books, but here's the thing: We already have a metric fuck-ton of stories where the very shitty author has Hermione discover she's actually pure-blood and, because of this, it turns out she has magical abilities and is more powerful (and is suddenly willing to date Draco because I guess racism is okay with Hermione, when it's not directed at her, despite what we see of her in canon).

We also have just as many, if not more, stories where Harry discovers that Lily was secretly a pure-blood, thus making him one as well, and suddenly he has all sorts of powers and abilities (and a Louisville Slugger for a dick).

True, in the above cases, often the new abilities and increased spell power showing up at the same time the character discovers their real blood status is seemingly just coincidence, with the often increased wealth, political power, and new social status being directly linked, but it's written in such a (clumsy) way that it just comes off as, "Pure-bloods are the Ubermensch, mudbloods are the Morlocks."

Hell, most of the time these stories even have Hermione being prettier after she discovers she's a pure-blood. Even her hair is suddenly better! (The parallel here with the real-world notion of there being "good hair" and "bad hair" is just disturbing.) At least Harry's improved physique is written as a correction of his malnutrition, not as a result of his pure-blood birthright.

I guess Merope Gaunt being a dirt poor near-squib who looked like she fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down, despite being a pure-blood, somehow escaped the authors.

These people seem to entirely miss the point of the books and are apparently oblivious to the fact they're essentially writing stories where the lesson is, "The racism in the Harry Potter universe is totally justified because pure-bloods are simply born better than everyone else."

What I'm getting at is that there are already a lot of stories out there where the racist beliefs of the bigots in HP are true. Not only does that kind of thinking suck, but it sucks that the inclination to see one group as superior to another is so ingrained in us, or at least the authors, that the people writing this stuff are (in most cases) totally oblivious to the racism they're putting down on the page.

I've seen so much of it that, frankly, the idea of reading more of it, except that this time it would be written with the fully-conscious objective of justifying the systematic racism of wizards with biological fact, doesn't interest me in the slightest.

Long story short: I'll leave alone whether or not the idea to write a story where the racist beliefs in Harry Potter are based on hard fact is a clever one or not, and simply say that it's been done many times before, often without the authors and readers even realizing it.

There are a few massive ironies of the Harry Potter series; one of them, and probably the most sad, is that J.K. Rowling's world of witches, wizards, and magical beings is not real... but the prejudice against half-bloods and muggle-borns is.

The magic is imaginary, but what was supposed to be merely fantastic racism has turned out to be very real; it lives in the hearts and minds of many readers in a way that the phoenixes and dragons can't. And, that is very, very, sad.

 

Well of course it is sad and very wrong, that was the point here.

You see, I was simply proposing an alternative.

In canon, the purists are clearly wrong, because there really is no difference between purebloods and muggleborns.

Now I ask about scenarion which asks: "But what if they were right?"

The examples you mentioned Warlocke are not exactly what I'm asking about, because as you've said, they have Harry suddenly discover that Lily was a pureblood after all, similarly with Hermione.

I'm instead asking about a premise where Hermione is actually untalented, practically worse than Crabbe or Goyle.

Why? For two reasons.

1. This will make everything harder for the protagonists, that means Harry. And it will make his victory so much more earned and deserving.

2. In canon, it is essentially "Purebloods are better? No they're not!" but here it would be "Purebloods are better. So what?". Just because purebloods would be better at magic wouldn't matter they have a right to kill muggleborns and muggles. Of course then we're getting into the realm of realpolitik and the fact "Well who's going to stop them?"

Harry, Harry is going to stop them.

 

Not sure that simplifies anything. I'd choose Half-Blood all day or mute all day.

Probably unrelated news: I'm making an attempt at that Harry/fem!Draco fic I outlined a page or so back.

 

Personally, what really bothers me about your idea is that you think anything close to Canon will still exist. It seems insane to claim Tom Riddle still manages to become the Dark Lord Voldemort who has to kill Harry Potter. It's madness, and has a whole lot of problems.

If you absolutely must write this Story, then be more creative with what happens. Have a "Master-Race" Breeding thing going on. Get the Halfbloods and Muggleborns angry enough to do something. Write laws that encourage Purebloods marrying Purebloods and Muggleborns marrying Muggleborns. Really explore the ramifications for this World before you start talking about Voldemort or Harry.

 

I could see a few possible almost canon-compliant ways to tune Xandrel's "Purebloods are Superior" idea.

Have it so that the old families carry a bloodline gift, much like Parseltongue, which must be granted in a ceremony similar to baptism. Merope made sure Tom was anointed right at birth, which also explains how Voldemort made quick progress despite coming into Slytherin lacking any credentials. A pureblood can get gifts from both parents (or maybe even from several godparents as well), but the rituals to do so are often held back to ensure the younger generation doesn't get uppity too soon. This also explains how Crabbe the way dim was able to summon Fiendfyre (even if he couldn't control it).

Canon supports the idea that the muggleborns can learn the rote magic as well as any, but they weren't powerful. It could be that a Pureblood could resist the Basilisk stare in ways that Hermione, Colin and Penelope just couldn't.

Another version has to do with faith vs. science- perhaps the spotty education given at Hogwarts is done on purpose, so as not to limit the possibilities for spellwork. It could be that Hermione's ability to change the laws of physics becomes more limited the more she learns about them.

 

Curious thing... In this hypothetical world, magical talent in purebloods could be some made up fixed number. Let's say 100. Then, muggles would be 0. Muggleborn would be half of these 3/4, so 3/8, which, expressed in our system, would be 37.5. Then it would get interesting. Child of a "perfect" pureblood and a muggle would be 75 (here we can see that magical talent a la Xandrel is not linear, so my numbers are imprecise). Child of a muggleborn and a half blood would be somewhere in between, let's say 56.25. See? Talent of every child could be calculated beforehand, even before its birth, by studying its ancestry. While I wouldn't read a story that would use this idea (I am somewhat inclined to believe Taure now), it is interesting enough to at least speculate about it.

 

And, my response remains the same. I've already seen stories where pure-bloods were portrayed as being just plain better than everyone else.

That in those stories the promotion of pure-blood superiority was the thoughtless and unintentional result of bad writers writing badly, and in your idea would be done on purpose, doesn't change my level of interest. That, in your idea, the racism is shown to be bad, even though pure-bloods really are better at magic, still doesn't change my level of interest.

Other people might very well be interested; I, for my part, am not. The 'twist' you're putting on the idea might matter to other people; for me, it doesn't

I've seen too much unconscious approval of the pure-bloods' imagined superiority in HP fan fic, gobbled up by readers too thoughtless and shallow to catch the implications of what they're reading, to be interested in the proposal of a thoughtful presentation of actual pure-blood superiority even when paired with condemnation of pure-blood bigotry.

For me, there's too much baggage attached to the idea to make another take on it be entertaining.

That's my opinion, of course, and no one needs to convince me that their ideas are good ones. I doubt the interest of a single reader ever made or broke a story.

 

You're saying like Harry found a mcguffin and used that to gain eldritch powers, in order to overcome Voldemort in a 1v1 fight, when the truth of things it's been a shitload of lucky circumstances.

His victory in your world would be even more so, considering he would be intentionally, and irreversibly, handicapped, no matter that Voldemort would technically be less powerful than Harry, due to his parents being a near-squib and a muggle.

 

You know, I just figured out why Xandrel made this one: it's all part of an ideal he has that Magic is Best. In a bunch of his other ideas, he likes to have that idea where Magic and Wizards are better than Science and Muggles. This is just the latest version, where it is downright a bad thing for Purebloods to mingle their gene pool with Muggles, Muggleborns, or even Halfbloods.

 

Lets go completly over the top.

There is "Ubermensch" breeding program. It has existed for a long time, in different iterations. And every time it fucked up, big time. It always produces a bunch of sterile sociophats, with shit-load of magical potential, and psychotic tendencies. No matter what the wizards tried, it always ended that way. But they still are trying to do it. And right now they are looking at solutions, unthinkable sometime ago - muggles. Who do you think funded most of the Human Genome Project? Apparently, muggle science is way ahead in the filed of genetics than wizards.

How did muggleborns and half-bloods, counter the superior powers of purebloods? They cheated. Dark Magic is faster, stronger and easier to cast. Muggleborns also devised rituals and procedures of stealing someones magic - mainly by taking someones blood.

Hell, if you want, we could go all Nanomachines, son! and have muggleborns use them to match purebloods in power. Just kick the HP setting some 40 years into the future, or just make it a crossover with Metal Gear Solid.

 

Wow. I totally agree about your take on lazy crossovers....

I would be willing to read a crossover like that if anybody wrote it...... I think it might read as an international thriller then. It would be fun if Setsuna Meiou jumped around to different countries as a vigilante crime-fighter helping teach Muggle-borns how to do cool transformations and fight the bad guys (i.e. the legit magical authorties)...

 

I had a more sinister idea, for her motivation. She would rope unsuspecting muggle girls, into this entire Silver Millenium/Dark Kingdom shtick, to test her new magical creations. She would - through her magically controlled cats - give the muggle girls, her newly created magical tools.

Setsuna, when she was employed in the DoM, was supporting a team working on creating magical weapons, that did not need the wielder to posses magic. It was an old idea, created before the Statue of Secrecy came into effect. It was supposed, to be given to royal guards, to gat some favors from the rulling royals. In present time, it was enchanced, to offer more power, protection, etc. It never went into testing phase, because of politics. Setsuna being a scientis at heart, decided to steal it, and test it on her own. This is why she ended up in Japan, thinking that the other side of the world would be safe. Plus, in my version, Japan is almost completly magic-free, thanks to Americans bombing Hiroshima and Nagasaki and killing 99,5% of Japans wizarding population (Hiroshima) and completly destroying its Ministry and main school (Nagasaki) [ICW treats USA wizards as an almost rogue state, because they used muggles to settle their score with the Japanese wizards - something that is frowned upon, but was not forbiden under the SoS]

Using smoke and mirrors, and plain bullshit, she uses the girls as test subject for her new toys and experimental magical creatures (Youma). Also, because she need money (creating money by magic is easy, but puting it into circulation is hard, as the ICW keeps a very close eye on muggle economy, to prevent economic collapse from happening), she starts going into organized crime, using the girls as her enforcers. And erasing and modyfing their memories - after all, they just blowed up a warehouse full of Youma and not full of men of the opposite gang. Did I mention, going into prostitution and organ harvesting?

And now, Auror Harry James Potter, comes into Japan, to arrest Setsuna Meiou. He just have to go through her 8 magically powered and brainwashed enforcers. They don't have the reach or flexibility of HP magic, but they have been using their powers in battles for quite some time and they know what they are doing. And so does Potter.

 

I like the idea of making the death eater's cause a little more justified. Although Xandrel's latest bunny has a little too much on power levels for my liking.

Not that I would like to reach the point where is okay to kill muggleborns or like those pro-Dark where every death eater is a misunderstood guy and are only protecting their Dark (but not evil, only Halloween flavored) traditions for reasons and every heinous crime committed by them is retconned as Dumbledore's propaganda.

But something that make them more than evilly evil racist bastards, that you can at least get the whys of their action beyond mindless hatred for icky mudbloods. I read in a fanfic once (I think it was Taure's maybe) where Draco explained that there was a limited number of magical births and a fixed number of muggleborns births, so as the population grew so did the squib's number. Or something. Sure, it doesn't make the killing okay, but at least they were fighting for their children's right to have magic.

To sum up, make the Death Eater a tiny bit more ambiguous and 'grey'.

@Wordhammer: To be honest, the bloodline gifts (at least going by the traditional ones: parseltongue, metamorphmagus and sometimes animagus) do not seem to be much more than some cool trick of limited breadth, sure being a metamorphmagus is useful but it can be mostly replicated by wand or potion. It doesn't seem to be enough to make the pure-blooded actually superior.

Unless you 'buff' the gifts, but then you might come to the point where they surpass in relevance and power the wand-magic, which, at least to me, wouldn't be very interesting.

An alternative would be having a plethora of potions and/or rituals that can only used on a child, at they early years, that makes them generally smarter, better, faster, stronger. And maybe even better at magic, to go with the skill=power, gives them some instinctive understanding of magic plus the smarter bit.