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A Song of Ice and Fire by George RR Martin [Spoilers]

Discussion in 'Movies, Music and TV shows' started by Philly Homer, May 3, 2009.

  1. Xiph0

    Xiph0 Yoda Admin

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    Yeah, that's such bullshit. He went like 3,000 miles in an episode.

    They pretty much said the Children made them as a nuclear option when the Andals were first pushing them out of Westeros. I'll wait and see if I'm satisfied by that whole line of details.
     
  2. Spanks

    Spanks Chief Warlock

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    I'm convinced the visual effects guys are in a room saying "yeah, we can give you a big zombie army, but we gotta cut the direwolves to do it."

    Someone on twitter pointed out that there was an Easter egg in this episode. The place where the Children changed that man into a White Walker had a specific spiral shape which has shown up in earlier seasons link, I can't find a pic of this the spot where they created that White Walker yet.

    Kinda curious how Meera is going to get Bran back to the Wall by herself. It ain't like Bran can do much to defend them. Maybe they'll bring in Coldhands or Benjen Stark.
     
  3. Invictus

    Invictus Master of Death

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    The White Walkers being a creation of the Children gone wrong, their hubris so to say, being the cause of their decline and the last resort weapon being much much worse than the original enemy does fit into GRRM themes too, specially his subversion and desconstruction of fantasy elements, the "Elves" causing their own doom and etc. Specially if the White Walkers aren't just the supreme evil that they seem to be.
     
  4. funkytoad

    funkytoad Fifth Year

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    I thought that the Night's King was a former Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, and that the Night's Watch itself along with the Wall was created to keep the White Walkers out.

    How's that work?
     
  5. R. E. Lee

    R. E. Lee Groundskeeper

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    I've actually heard complaints about this in seasons past. Littlefinger is absent in like half the episodes, but he's able to go from the Vale to Winterfell (or to Molestown) between episodes, while somehow Asha Greyjoy takes a season to sail from the Iron Islands to the Dreadfort?

    Also, that ending. Damn...
     
  6. Jeram

    Jeram Elder of Zion ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Oh. One more for the road:

    Hodor.
     
  7. Xiph0

    Xiph0 Yoda Admin

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    So as far as I understand:

    - The "Others" have always existed, and the First Men and Children pushed them north of the Wall and erected the Wall during their 4,000 years of friendship.

    - The ritual that makes "Others" is known to the Children and can be replicated by them (the ritual circle they show in the episode being the same as the ritual circle shown when we're first shown the baby being turned into a Whitewalker).

    - When the Andals invade Westeros and finally start to eradicate all the Children left in the Riverlands/Stormlands (South of Moat Cailin) they press the Nuke button and make walkers.

    I could be totally wrong and they might have actually used it in their war against the First Men and might be the True Originators of them. Just seems more likely to me that it'd be used on the Andals.
     
  8. Lamora

    Lamora Definitely Not Batman ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    This episode mindfucked the shit out of me. Holy fucking shit.

    Anyone who caught the episode as an HBO subscriber can, optionally, catch the Inside the Episode segment at the end of this one. I recommend you do, as in this one, DnD literally tell people that the Hodor=Hold The Door thing was something directly told to them by GRRM in a hotel room.

    Which means it's likely to be in some form book canon. Which means, almost certainly, that it's canon that greenseers can FUCKING HACK TIME TO DO SHIT TO THE PAST.

    WHAT THE FUCK. WHAT THE TITTYFUCKING CHRIST.

    There was no leadup to this. None. This season has officially impressed me, or at least convinced me to watch the rest in the hopes of more Winds of Winter spoilers.

    You got me good George, you absolute fucker.
     
  9. Spanks

    Spanks Chief Warlock

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    I do wonder what the limits on Bran being able to interfere with the past are. Being able to make changes to the past seems a bit heavy handed for GRRM's preference for subtle magic. Like, I can't imagine that he can make the Mad King into a good guy and stop burning people or anything. I think what the 3 eyes raven was saying was legit, that time can't be changed. So, Bran was meant to do that to do that to Hodor (why the hell else would they be viewing such an unimportant memory when the fucking Others are at your doorstep?).

    But yeah, I now have more confidence in that theory that Bran does the same thing to the Mad King only the Mad King hears someone screaming "Burn them all!" while under an attack by wights. Aerys becomes crazy hearing the voice(s) in his head screaming to burn them all.
     
  10. Tsar

    Tsar Sixth Year DLP Supporter

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    Where were you when Game of Thrones jumped the shark?
     
  11. R. E. Lee

    R. E. Lee Groundskeeper

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    In the books, the Children only fought directly against the First Men. That war took place several thousand years before the arrival of the Andals, and the Long Night--the war of the Children and the First Men against the Others--took place in between. By the time that the Andals arrived and were chopping down Weirwoods in the South, it was the First Men who were worshiping them and the Children were already scarce.

    If the show follows the book timeline (not something we can assume at this point), then when the Children say they made the Others "to fight against you," then they meant against the First Men/Starks/whatever, rather than against man in general.
     
  12. Andrela

    Andrela Plot Bunny DLP Supporter

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    Also, can we appreciate how the writers...

    Wrote Donald Trump into the show?

    "WE'RE GONNA BUILD BOATS. THE BEST BOATS ANYONE HAS EVER SEEN"

    "THE IRON ISLANDS HAVE LOST AGAINST WESTEROS FOR TOO LONG. THEY LAUGH AT US. ME? I BEAT WESTEROS ALL THE TIME."

    "IF I WERE RUNNING THE IRON ISLANDS, I'D MURDER ME NEPHEW AND NIECE. I MEAN, I'D LOOK THEM RIGHT IN THOSE COCKLESS CROTCHES OF THEM, I'D SAY "ME NEPHEW AND NIECE, YOU'RE MURDERED"

    "THEON IS NOT A HERO. HE WAS A HERO BECAUSE HE WAS CAPTURED. I LIKE PEOPLE WHO WEREN'T CAPTURED."

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Xepheria

    Xepheria The Benefactor

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    Sadly for Westeros, the Wall is not going to get ten feet higher. In fact, I feel like D&D are going to end the season with a shot of the Wall crumbling down, and the Walkers entering Westeros proper, especially considering that mark on Bran's arm, and the line from the Three Eyed Raven.

    The moment he crosses the wall, he's going to become 'Brandon the Breaker'.
     
  14. Celestin

    Celestin Dimensional Trunk

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    I didn't occur to me while watching, but you're probably right. The moment Bran crosses the Wall, the Others can do the same.

    As for the episode, the ending alone make it one of the best in the series. At the same time, I'm little sad for GRRM. How many other scenes like this will be revealed in the show because of his inability to finish the books? Some may say he doesn't care anymore, but I doubt that.

    Also, people saying this was heartwrenching? Just wait till Bran meets his companions turned into wights because I fully expect this kind of a sucker punch in the season 7 or 8.

    The play and Arya's reaction to it was excellent. It's telling how different people not directly involved in events leading up to the War of the Five Kings perceive them.

    If I have one complain about the show, it's Euron. I like his actor and he's doing a really good job playing a true ironborn wanting to rule the Seven Kingdoms. What he lacks is all of the creepiness of the book Euron. No crow's eye, no pale blue lips, no Silence or any mentions of secrets he could discover on his voyages. For now he's just another dangerous man with ambitions to be the king.
     
  15. Viewtiful

    Viewtiful Groundskeeper

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    Speaking of Direwolves being cut for budgetary reasons (presumably for the ridiculous looking skeletons), it seems like they had practically no money for any of the Ironborn scenes. A couple dozen Lords show up to the Kingsmoot and do nothing but chant "Asha", then instantly switch to "Euron", and even less show up to see Euron be crowned. We don't even get to see Asha and Euron give real speeches, they both just say they'll build a bunch of ships.

    Why even adapt the stroyline if it's going to be so halfassed?
     
  16. Celestin

    Celestin Dimensional Trunk

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    The same reason they gave us Dorne? Whatever that reason was.

    Anyway, something I noticed after five episodes. This season has two big themes. One is obvious and it's a resurrection/rebirth. Jon literally, Dany by fire, Euron by water, Theon by being Theon again and there are rumours of other characters returning that definitely fit this theme. Not sure if it will lead to something in the finale or it's just there.

    Other is kinslaying. Unlike in the previous season, in this one the Sand Snakes, Ramsay, Euron did it in the open and apparently nobody cares. At first it bothered me since it was suppose to be a big deal in Westeros, but now I find it fitting. If there is an upcoming (winter) apocalypse then a societal collapse is one of its signs. In a world as brutal as this, making one of its worst crimes, kinslaying, becoming an acceptable behaviour is how it could be presented.
     
  17. Goten Askil

    Goten Askil Groundskeeper

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    The first thing I thought after the Tower of Joy scene was that Bran calling his father was part of the reason he was too late to save Lyanna. It went with the three-eyed raven's face at the time. Now that it's confirmed that Bran can and did affect the past, I'm not sure it's only my inner sadist thinking of that anymore.

    Also, I hope it wasn't the last time we were shown the past. We still need that Harrenhal flashback.

    Hold the door, people.
     
  18. JErosion

    JErosion DA Member

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    I think the story was that there was one a King of the Wall/ King of the Night's Watch, who fell to ruin when he took a Wildling bride, but the bride was one of the White Walkers. Afterwards the position of King of the Wall was discontinued.
     
  19. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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  20. Red

    Red High Inquisitor DLP Supporter

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    I'm convinced Bran made Aerys into the Mad King by whispering to him while warging into the past. He told the King that the way to kill walkers was to "Burn them all".

    You know what, Bran is also his own ancestor. Wargs into the past to make sure the wall is built hence Bran the Builder.
     
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