So is Dorne just never being mentioned again? (Not that I really want to see more).

 

I loved the scene where Jon is getting trampled because it was like Jon decided that he wanted to keep living. To me it seemed as though ever since his resurrection Jon became disillusioned with life and did not really care if he lived or died which could help explain some of his actions in the battle; obviously the main point of Jon's suicide charge was because he was pissed at Ramsay but I think some part of it was that Jon just didn't care too much if he lived or died.

Also what do you guys think about the allusions to Sansa possibly being pregnant in the last episode?

 

If so, I hope she gets punched really hard in the stomach.

 

if so...Time to drink the Moon tea, quickly.

 

I really dislike Sansa, out of all the characters she is the only one who has simply hung around and whined at people while contributing absolutely nothing.
As for her not telling Jon about the Vale I think that it's mostly the fact that she didn't think to tell him rather than not telling him out of spite, and just before the battle she whines again about not having enough people. Ramsey was just taking advantage of a girl who was never smart enough to get out of his way.
Although I thought Ramsey's death was the highlight of the episode.

 

I see the Lindsey Tron 3000 has malfunctioned. Can someone reset it to factory settings?

By writer fiat, sure. I mean if Rickon had elected to bob and weave he might also still be alive.

Lolno. Rickon's life was forfeit because the writers changed up the Umbers, sure. But if Jon and Sansa had the Knights of the Vale dead to rights earlier then things might have been different.

Trying so hard without telling him a goddamn thing, after already delaying a Vale arrival by being such a flighty idiot. If that Vale army had been there, perhaps the Manderlys might have also declared. Perhaps they could have caught Ramsey's army on the march and rescued Rickon. Any number of things could have happened besides Sansa acting like a derp for no goddamn reason.

And if the siege did happen, do you think Umber or Karstark couldn't have considered their options and tried to defect back with Rickon as collateral? You chat about Winter is coming, but this is the goddamn North and I'd trust the people who lived in the entire region and control all it's food resources while the foreigners are trapped behind a castle that they themselves know.

1. And yet she was comfortable sending Brienne to get Brynden and talking up Brynden, despite the unlikelihood of that.
2. Lolno. You don't sit around say she "probabyly said this and probably said that". Use what's on screen or just stop trying to defend her.
3. That link is bullshit and is a bending over backwards to try and excuse Sansa. Not to mention it being hilarious as fuck for you to use it, going from "Oh she didn't trust Jon" to "Oh she probably told Jon" to "Oh she really didn't trust Jon the bastard". Meanwhile that link goes of going that Ramsay is a bastard for sacrificing his blood, but at the same time OP argues that Jon is a bastard for refusing to sacrifice his brother". Except it can't be both, it really can't. Sansa tricks and betrays Jon while sacrificing Rickon every bit as much as Ramsay does, their actions are virtually identical.

Why the fuck would you listen to someone who isn't contributing anything? Sansa fails utterly in recruiting the Houses, she lies about how she learns of Brynden, she doesn't mention the Knights of the Vale and she never says anything to guide Jon in another direction nor does she take the initiative to describe or share her understanding of the Bolton house politics or the Bolton men themselves. Not to mention Jon went to save Rickon, who with Bran disappeared is the rightful lord of Winterfell, aka Sansa and Jon's liege lord by rights. That he reacted as he did afterwards was idiotic but understandable yes, but that was the culmination of events laid in motion by Sansa's inaction. Her brother's death is her fault, as much as her father's death was her fault, as much Catelyn's death was Robb's fault.

And in doing so she got her brother killed, killed hundreds of men loyal to House Stark, sent away her one loyal knight, lied to her other brother and amounted to jack shit once more. Good for Sansa, she of little ado and nothing done.

 

RIP Wun Wun, your sacrifice will never be forgotten.

 

What's even more annoying is how they showed her failing. She let Jon and Davos take the lead at every meeting despite being the Stark. And when she did talk she put her foot in her mouth with Lyanna Mormont and annoyed Lord Glover. Not exactly a great way to write the future leader of the North.

 

Lolno. That's what our boy Bran is for.

Shit, there's only 3 and 1/2 Starks left. Fuck.

 

To make this short, I'll say that I mostly agree with the flaws people have pointed out, but this episode was so cool that I don't care.

The tracking shot of Jon fighting and stumbling through cavalry was a masterstroke, one of best moments of TV ever.

RIP Ramsay motherfucking Snow. Maybe Sansa is right and you'll be forgotten, but not by me. I will keep your amazing, repulsive bastardry in my memory. You were given a send-off you deserved. Fuckin' legend.

 

They weren't portrayed as dumb. They just have a different vernacular, and an educational system skewed towards surviving the cold and zombies.

 

Regarding Rickon's death, a friend of mine told me something interesting the other day and I thought I'd share it here. Have any of you heard of a shaggy dog story?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaggy_dog_story

Given this, it seems likely that it was always George's plan to have Rickon die a pointless death. Well played, sir, well played.

 

I'd say that if it's so that's a crude thing to do, both as a writer and a storyteller.

 

Said my words exactly. I was happy when Daenerys scorched the Sons of the Harpy, because screw them.

 

I wonder how people can misinterpret two women flirting outrageously as a "girl power" dynamic.

 

I hope to God that G.R.R. Martin just forgets all about Dorne and concentrates elsewhere. It had so much potential but looks to be ruined now, (judging by the show).

 

Show Dorne has nothing to do with Book Dorne.

Book Dorne could well play a pivotal role in how things turn out.

 

I don't think people realise just how much the books and TV have diverged.

I'm not sure if book stuff counts as spoilers since the TV show is ahead of the books, but there are some significant plot lines in the books that are not at all in the TV show and I doubt can be added.

With out them the out come is going to have to be vastly different.

I think it was maybe end of season 4 that the show departed far enough from the books that it had really become its own story line that could no longer be meshed with the books.