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Harry as [MOTHERFUCKING SPOILER]

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by Lightfighter, Aug 16, 2011.

  1. Red Aviary

    Red Aviary Hogdorinclawpuff ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Like others have said, I think his debt is canceled out by taking on the Winter Knight's mantle. Though there's also a clause regarding those three favors where he has the option to refuse them if he wished to, so she might have had a tough time of subverting his will if she ever got around to trying something like that anyway.
     
  2. Consumptus

    Consumptus Groundskeeper

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    But that wasn't part of the deal when he was bargaining for extra time to rescue his daughter first. And we all know how Sidhe are about being specific.
    I think the favor is still owed.

    But now with his obligation as Winter Knight, I'm sure Mab could spin it to force him to do something citing his favor he owes her. Something to that effect.
     
  3. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    Dresden still retains the right of refusal though. I mean, Mab could torture him into insanity if he refuses, but the threat of such hasn't stopped him before. Mab still has the favor I'm pretty sure, but it won't be enough to completely control him.
     
  4. Red Aviary

    Red Aviary Hogdorinclawpuff ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Actually, another clause in the agreement was that there would be no reprisals or punishments should he refuse. (Got the book right next to me ;))

    The exact details of the agreement are on Page 30 of Summer Knight, in the paperback edition at least, if anyone wants to give it a look.
     
  5. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    Yea, but since he's the Winter Knight, she can torture him because she felt like it (ie, Slate). It doesn't necessarily have to be because he refused her. It's stretching it, but that's kinda what Fae do in the first place.
     
  6. Psychotic Cat

    Psychotic Cat Chief Warlock

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    Yeah, but what was Slate? Mediocre, he was a mediocre knight and that's just terrible.

    Mab worked too hard getting Harry to risk screwing it up now.
    It's not like there can be that many wizards on Harrys level that would be willing to take on the mantle.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2011
  7. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    Well yea. She's not going to risk harming the relationship with Dresden, at least until he performs the function she wants him for. Which means she's not going to push the issue about enforcing her will on him, which renders the entire debate moot.

    Assuming she is willing to compromise a working relationship with Dresden though, she has several options to force his cooperation, with or without the favor still owed. Being the Winter Knight just gives Mab more options to control him with.
     
  8. Ragon

    Ragon Dark Lord

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    Slightly off topic and this may have been brought up before by someone else in a different thread.

    Has anyone considered how this might affect the balance of the courts? Winter and Summer have to maintain a balance. Like how the courts didn't become involved with the reds right away because they had to have a balance, and the summer knight being killed. My point is, it seems like Mab has just gained a major boost for Winter; so how does this affect Titania and Fix. Everyone and their mother, including Fix, knows that Harry is a far more powerful knight that Fix. Harry was already an dangerous and very powerful wizard before he became winter knight. I wonder if this doesn't throw the courts out of balance with the Winter knight being so much stronger than the Summer knight and if it does what will be done to fix the balance.
     
  9. Celestin

    Celestin Dimensional Trunk

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    I think that the balance may stay as it is, because Dresden is much more unwilling to do Mab's commands than Fix. So, even if Harry is more powerful, she can't use him as freely as Titania is using her Knight.
     
  10. Thaumologist

    Thaumologist Fifth Year ~ Prestige ~

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    Also, in comparison the entire court, even Harry isn't that powerful. Lacking a knight means an incredibly lack of power: one of the top three or four faces of the court is dead and/or not there.

    One court fighting the Reds would be a HUGE sway in the power, as the court would likely throw a large amount of their own power that direction.

    So on a person to person basis, Harry >> Fix. But on a court level, Winter !>> Summer.
     
  11. Lightfighter

    Lightfighter Third Year DLP Supporter

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    I have nothing to back this up, but seems to me that as long as both Courts have a Knight, regardless of who the Knight is or how powerful, they're balanced. After all, both queens are free to recruit whoever they want as their Knight; technically, it's not Mab's fault that Titania has a weaker Knight when they could both choose. And even if in actuality Mab does have the upper hand now, by the rules she's perfectly fine. And the Sidhe are really big on rules and bargains and the like.

    I am curious to see how Fix and Summer reacts to this, though, considering that the mere possibility of Harry being the WK was enough for Fix to shove a shotgun in his face.
     
  12. Aekiel

    Aekiel Angle of Mispeling ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Summer is actually a bit stronger than Winter at the moment overall; global warming is a result of it according to Jim. Still, they probably still haven't recovered from losing Aurora. Lily was just a changeling when she was made Knight, and Summer Lady immediately after that. Aurora was likely hundreds, maybe thousands of years old and had the experience/connection/debts to go with it. Lily doesn't have that.

    So yeah, Summer may be weaker in the powerful spellcasters area than Winter, but they still have the overall advantage and there are still millions upon millions of creatures at each side's disposal. One being cannot contend against all of them, at least not at the Ladies' level.
     
  13. Celestin

    Celestin Dimensional Trunk

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    Unless this one being is Harry "I totally killed the entire Red Court (even if all I did was to "pull the trigger")" Dresden. :)

    I will be very disappointed if we never see any very scared reactions of weaker beings when they meet Dresden from now on. Not many knows how he did it, most probably assume that he wiped Reds off, because we was tired of playing a war with them. ;)
     
  14. Aekiel

    Aekiel Angle of Mispeling ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    So Harry Dresden is like Kemmler and Chuck Norris combined into one? :p
     
  15. LittleChicago

    LittleChicago Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    ... why do you say that like it wasn't obvious?
     
  16. TheWiseTomato

    TheWiseTomato Prestigious Tomato ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    In regards to the balance with Dresden being WK, maybe that actually restores it (to a point)? One one hand, the Knight of the Winter court can stomp all over the Knight of Summer, but on the other, Mab is wounded.
     
  17. Nemrut

    Nemrut The Black Mage ~ Prestige ~

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    Yeah, Mab just severely weakened herself and probably ignored some of her duties for the last six months, giving Summer an edge. But now with Dresden as the knight, it might balance out. Winter is stronger right now but Summer is leading in points. (metaphorically speaking, of course.)

    That said, I never thought that balance was meant to be literally. It doesn't have to be a 50/50 scale all the time. I mean, we do have the seasons in which one court has the advantage. I take it that balance rather means that each court has equal time being superior to the other, which, overall, makes it balanced.
     
  18. T3t

    T3t Purple Beast of DLP ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    I agree with Nemrut. I never thought that balanced had to mean equal - after all, each court has a superior position on all but two days of the year.
     
  19. Aekiel

    Aekiel Angle of Mispeling ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    I see it more like relations between the US and the Soviet Union (and a Cold War is essentially what the Faerie Courts have), where one side may not be the equal of the other at any one moment, they're both more than powerful enough to make victory extremely costly; too costly for the winning Court to be much of a threat to anyone afterwards.
     
  20. Joschneide

    Joschneide Groundskeeper

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    Just compare Ronald Reuel to Slate. It was heavily implied in Summer Knight that Reuel could've wiped the floor with Slate in a heads up fight and managed it in a neater fashion than Slate ever could.

    Pretty sure mantles being out there = as balanced as it can be.

    Otherwise Fix would need a significant boost in power as far as raw balance and Dresden a slight bit more experience in using his Winter power. Because as of now, in a duel of just Summer versus Winter power, Fix has more experience and could likely knock Dresden down.
     
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