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The Blackstaff and Black Magic

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by Alive and Free, Feb 14, 2012.

  1. Alive and Free

    Alive and Free Groundskeeper

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    So - a question. Shouldn't the Blackstaff be seriously unhinged or twisted?

    Stay with me for a minute and I'll lay out my logic. The Blackstaff has the power to break the Laws of Magic at will and we see McCoy do this in Changes when he kills hundreds of human mercenaries.

    Now I was under the impression that killing with magic, especially multiple times, had a detrimental effect on a person because it twists the basic nature of magic. So shouldn't the Blackstaff be kind of unstable or twisted?

    Also - not sure whether this is canon or fanon - but can't Dresdenverse wizards sense when someone's used dark magic to kill. I think it was mentioned in Backup (the novella from Thomas' POV). So how does McCoy hide what he's done?
     
  2. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    The solution to the very problem you mention is in the name of the position. It's not something they randomly chose. It derives from the staff he carries, an all black abomination that's mentioned in Celtic myth. I forget the mythological name, but the legend goes it kills with one end and revives the dead with the other. In Dresdenverse, the person who wields it can use it as a focus for black magic without suffering the psychic backlash, as the staff absorbs it.
     
  3. Peace

    Peace High Inquisitor

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    @Agayek; is that explained in canon cause I don't remember reading it.
     
  4. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    It's not directly stated in the books (though it is implied). Butcher described how it works in a Q&A at some point. It's probably in the WoJ thread if you wanna dig through that.
     
  5. Datakim

    Datakim Chief Warlock

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    We do see the effect of the staff itself, when it does something to McCoy right after he kills (absorbs the taint of black magic caused by violating the first law or something like that). Its described as "veins of black ooze" which spread from the staff to the guys wrist, and its implied to be painfull given that Eb grimaces during this process.

    McCoy also basically summons the staff from nothingness with just a word, something we havent seen before and which further implies a clearly abnormal nature for a wizards staff. Dresden also describes the staff as "pulsing" and being "alive and wanting to be used". Its clearly not a normal focus, but somekind of utterly unique artifact. Thats probably why there is also only one blackstaff position in the council.

    However while the fact that Eb can instantly violate the first law several hundred times, and still is sane makes it pretty clear in the books indirectly that the blackstaff offer protection, the author has also stated it outright that the staff makes the user immune to corruption. You can probably find the specific quote somewhere. I seem to recall it also being mentioned in that quote, that the White Council stole the staff from someone who is rather upset at that, though I might be confusing that with something else.

    As for sensing the taint caused by killing with magic as Bob describes to Thomas in Backup, we don't know. Maybe right after its been used, something can be sensed, though its possible that the blackstaff cleanses that too, at the same time it removes the corruption itself.

    However McCoy and Dresden have soulgazed and Dresden apparently saw no hint at what McCoy does, so presumably even if there is some "residual taint", it is temporary at best, and the blackstaff itself prevents it from reaching the soul of the user. And since it was not visible in a soulgaze, I expect its equally invisible using the third sight.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2012
  6. Tesla

    Tesla Auror

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    I don't think the Blackstaff makes its wielder completely immune to corruption. Or rather, my theory is that whilst the staff might protect you from the backlashes of black magic, the wizard has to protect himself from the backlash of using such a dark weapon. That's probably why someone like McCoy - clearly a stubborn bastard - is the one who wields it. You gotta be able to handle the staff.
     
  7. Moridin

    Moridin Minister of Magic DLP Supporter

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    It's like Agayek said, the psychic backlash is absorbed by the staff. The psychological effects are something you need to deal with on your own, which is why the position of Blackstaff is not something given lightly.
     
  8. The Curious Fan

    The Curious Fan First Year

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    Isn't there a WoJ that they give the position to anyone who is trusted enough and is crazy enough to want the job?
     
  9. Portus

    Portus Heir

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    My Google-fu must be lacking; can you direct me to this particular myth?

    EDIT @ Agayek: Thanks. I remember reading about the bottomless cauldron long, long ago but I somehow missed references to the club.

    Oh, and that Wiki article links to another about the Fomorians. Sound familiar?
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2012
  10. Agayek

    Agayek Dimensional Trunk DLP Supporter

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    From what I understand of the various myths, the Blackstaff is derived from the club of the Dagda, King of the Tuatha De Danann. In particular:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dagda

    Judging by Butcher's various statements on the thing and how it looks/acts in the books, my money's on the original Blackstaff stealing it from the Dagda, who wants his stick back something fierce.
     
  11. Aekiel

    Aekiel Angle of Mispeling ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Just one thing to point out: Nowhere in the books does it say that there has been more than one Blackstaff. Ebenezar was the Blackstaff at least as far back as 1812, when he caused the New Madrid Earthquake. So there's a chance that he was the one to steal the Blackstaff, rather than a predecessor.

    That said, I'd probably put the Blackstaff being stolen at around the time of Merlin; the journals that Harry notices during Changes go back to Merlin himself, and it has been theorised that they are the journals of the Blackstaff.
     
  12. Another Empty Frame

    Another Empty Frame Fake Flamingo DLP Supporter

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    If that's the case, then we can expect Eb was right about Harry one day adding to them. Langtry (spelling?) should be dying in the next 2-5 books, and Eb in the next 4-7. Within this time we will also likely see a shift from Harry as Winter Knight, to an unknown point, to Blackstaff!Harry. This is just the most likely way we'll see Harry become the Blackstaff, which might not even happen.
     
  13. Sauce Bauss

    Sauce Bauss Second Year ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    The most common theory is that 'The Dresden Files' are Harry's Blackstaff journals.
     
  14. TheWiseTomato

    TheWiseTomato Prestigious Tomato ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    What? Where'd you get this from?
     
  15. Nae

    Nae The Violent

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    He just pulled a syed. :facepalm
     
  16. Another Empty Frame

    Another Empty Frame Fake Flamingo DLP Supporter

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    Oh FFS people, you have to look at what we expect/hope will happen (Harry as the Blackstaff) and then look at the best way for it to happen. I'm only saying The Merlin will die, if we expect Harry to reach Blackstaff, seeing as he would never allow Harry to take that post.
     
  17. w1lliam

    w1lliam Groundskeeper

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    On the topic of The Blackstaff, who had the position before Eb? Perhaps Langtry, who had to relinquish the position as he had accepted the title of Merlin.

    @Gambit: Of course he's going to die but for him to die in the next couple of books alot of the White Council will go down as well, it's not going to be an easy feat. You need to be a god to hit Edinborough and that's where he is.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2012
  18. Portus

    Portus Heir

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    There's no guarantee that Dresden will become the Blackstaff, and while I agree with the notion of The Dresden Files being his journals, that doesn't mean he's the Blackstaff either. After all, there's nothing stopping him writing his journals, whether he's the Blackstaff or even a member of the White Council.
     
  19. TheWiseTomato

    TheWiseTomato Prestigious Tomato ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Why would he never allow him to take the post? Granted, The Merlin has been hostile to Dresden in the past, but if Harry proved himself to be capable of taking up the Blackstaff and he was needed, The Merlin wouldn't say no just to spite him, he's too practical.

    At least, that's my immediate thought. It's entirely possible I'm confusing one of LittleChicago's fics for canon again.
     
  20. Dwitty

    Dwitty Seventh Year DLP Supporter

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    Y'all are making really good points, and I'm going to let you carry on, but, please, it's written 'Edinburgh'. Normally I wouldn't say anything but it's my home city and that spelling made my head hurt. By how you've written it you're probably saying it right though.

    As to the debate about Harry and his potential role as the Blackstaff, the position of the council on him has clearly been softening as the series progresses. It probably would have helped if he had been willing to 'play the game' as it were, with the White Council. Tying that into the issue of the Blackstaff being unhinged if he were Harry the Blackstaff the journals would be equally unhinged, they are not therefore the Blackstaff is not.
     
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